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Question:  “Who can hear the voice of Christ today?”  (Apostolics: Luke 10:16, “My sheep know My voice.”  Who hear you, ‘apostles,’ hear Me… Who rejects you rejects Me...”) 

Answer: It is a fact that Biblical Scripture is not the source of authority for ‘apostles’ – Wikipedia, “...Chief ‘apostle’ Hermann Niehaus, [from whom Niemeyer severed the OAC in 1912,] called the Scriptures withered hay and stinking stagnant well water.’”  This audacity towards God’s Almighty, Holy Word, (The Scriptures of the Bible viewed in context,) also infected churches like the Pentecostal/Charismatic Movement, where the Bible is called “dusty old love letters to the church.”  But let us never confuse their blasphemy with the Truth of God’s eternal Word.  Jesus proclaimed in Matthew 24:35, “[The material] heaven and earth will pass away, but My Word will never pass away,”  (2 Pt. 3:10-14.) 

¨ In addition, confusion about Jesus “voice” was liberally strewn throughout all the churches.  In Luke 10:16, Jesus was referring to His “sheep” as His true followers, as His ‘Voice’ is the truth of Scripture, not manmade doctrines.  Every time Jesus withstood Satan in the wilderness, He said, "It is written... It is written... It is also written..." (Mt. 4.)  When Jesus, after His resurrection, appeared to the disciples on the road to Emmaus, “He began at Moses and all the Prophets, [the Scriptures available at the time,] and expounded to them in all the Scriptures the things concerning Himself.” And after His resurrection, when He appeared to His disciples behind locked doors, “He opened their understanding to comprehend the Scriptures and said to them, ‘Thus it is written…’” (Lu. 24:25-27; 44-46.) 

¨ So, when Jesus proclaimed, “My sheep know My Voice,” He was not referring to His audible voice. “My sheep hear My Voice” is a metaphor for “My teaching, My Word, My written Word,” as found in the Bible, (Jn. 10:27-28.) From the context of this and other passages, Jesus was speaking to those who would accept and understand His teaching; His Gospel; His New Covenant Word.  Concerning His Teaching, Jesus has nothing to add to what He already said in the Gospels and explained through His disciples in the Epistles, (Heb. 1:1-14.) After Jesus ascended into His real heaven in the spirit world, (Acts 1:8-12,) His teachings were recorded on paper, as His disciples could not hear Him preach in an audible voice anymore.  If we now want to ‘hear’ Jesus’ ‘words,’ we must read the Bible in context to understand what He is saying.  As He did in the Old Testament, Jesus recorded His “Voice” for us in the Scriptures so we can know  and obey His Truth and will, (Rom. 12:1-3.)

¨ Jesus was, of course, also referring to the inward guidance of His indwelling Holy Spirit, the Teacher and Helper, Who will always lead His believers into the “all truth” of Scripture, (Jn. 16:13-16.) That is why we can never loosen the Holy Spirit and the written Word from each other, (Jn. 1:1-14.)


The context of this passage in John Chapter 10:22-30 is not about hearing Jesus’ audible voice. This is where Jesus made a clear distinction between Himself, (The Door, True Shepherd, Word of God, Narrow Gate, Way, Truth, Light, and Life,) and false shepherds, the paid “hirelings,” who open demonic doors to the spirit world in various ways to “steal, murder, and destroy” the body of Christ, (Mt. 24:1-31; Jn. 10:10; 1 Jn. 3:15.) What better way could Satan find to deceive us than to speak deception in audible voices that mimic the final, comprehensive Word of Jesus in the Bible?

¨ But if the apostles could be correct, no one would have been able to hear God’s ‘voice’ until the 1800’s, when the Apostolic Movement was established by Edward Irving.  It is ridiculous to think that God speaks ‘new revelation and audible guidance’ outside the truth of Scripture through ‘apostles,’ who proudly substitute Jesus and His True Word. 

¨ During the eternal New Testament Covenant, God only declares His Word and Will through His final Word and Prophet, Jesus, Who Is God Himself, as revealed in the contextual truth of New Testament Scripture! (Hebrews 1:1-3; 8:13; and chapters 7-9 explain the forms and functions of the separate Old and New Covenants and ‘prophets’ perfectly!) 

¨ Therefore, the only New Covenant ministry of real, Scriptural prophets in the true body of Christ of Scripturally born again believers, is now interpretative of Scripture; speaking Scriptural “edification, exhortation, and comfort to men,” (1 Cor. 14:3; 24-25.) Absolutely no one else but Jesus Himself, The Scriptural Word of God through His indwelling Holy Spirit, can “mediate” between God and man.  The indelible 1 Timothy 2:5 triumphantly declares, “There is [only] One God and One Mediator between God and man; the man Christ Jesus!” 


How can we receive Christ today?”  (Apostolics: Lu. 10:16: “Who receives an ‘apostle,’ receives Christ, and who rejects you, ‘apostles,’ rejects Me.”) 

Answer:  Their answer means people can only ‘receive’ Christ through them, as if redemption, salvation and blessing in Christ is not exclusively obtainable through personal faith in, acceptance of, and discipleship in the Lord Jesus, (Jn. 1:12-14; 3:3-5.)  No one can ever ‘receive Christ’ by joining a church and becoming a member, as they allege.  “God SO loved the [whole] world that He gave His only begotten Son, [not ‘apostles’ of any kind,] so that whoever [personally, sincerely, and steadfastly] believes in Him shall not perish but have eternal life,” (Jn. 3:16.) 

This again proves that one can truly take anything uncontextually from the Bible to ‘justify’ any teaching.  Jesus commanded His disciples in 1 John verses 9-10, “If anyone comes to you and does not bring this [Scriptural, contextual truth that I gave you,] do not receive him into your house nor greet him [as a fellow believer.’]  For he who [accepts him and] greets him shares in his evil deeds.” 

So, from the origins and unscriptural teachings of the Apostle Movement, it is clear that Jesus, in Luke 10:16, (still under the Old Testament Covenant before the cross and Pentecost,) did not send out these so-called ‘apostles’ that only came into being in the 1800’s.  He actually commissioned His seventy Hebrew disciples, (not ‘apostles,’) to go out and preach the coming of the Spiritual, Unseen Kingdom of God, (which was  established at the cross and not before then.)  Since Pentecost, Jesus’ New Testament Covenant Kingdom is “inside” the born again ‘hearts’ or human spirits of His true believers — opposed to the Judaist and other expectations of a physical, political kingdom of God here on earth

¨ In Luke chapter 10, when Jesus sent out the seventy disciples, He had not suffered and died to atone in full for the sin and cursedness of humanity yet.  Thus, Old Israel was still under the Old Testament covenant with the Hebrew nation, (Heb. 7-9; 8:13.)  This excluded all other non-Hebrew nations, (the gentiles,) who were only brought in after the cross and Pentecost, (Jn. 1:1-14; Acts 1:8-12; Mt. 28:18-20.)  As such, those seventy disciples could heal the sick, etcetera, but could only say that “the kingdom of God has come near to you,” not inside you like after Jesus’ cross, His physical resurrection, and ascension,” (Lu. 10:9; 17:12 KJV; 1 Cor. 3:16) 

¨ However, forty days after Jesus’ bodily resurrection and ascension, on the day of Pentecost, He sent the Holy Spirit to indwell every sincere believer in Him as a spiritual temple of God, (Jn. 3:16; Acts 2; 1 Cor. 6:17-20.)  (This has nothing to do with the dogma of the “apostolic spiritual mind.”)  Henceforward, (under the New Testament Covenant,) the Spiritual Kingdom of God and not the kingdom of heaven as apostles say, would be “within” believers, (Lu. 17:21 KJV.)  From then on, the Kingdom of God or Jesus Christ Himself would reside inside the spiritually born again ‘heart’ or human spirit of every sincere believer, because His spiritual, unseen Kingdom comes in every Scriptural born again ‘heart’ or human spirit and mind through the indwelling Holy Spirit in true believers, (1 Ths. 5:23; Heb. 10:16-18.)  This is the fulfillment of what Jesus taught us to pray for in Matthew 6:7-13.  The coming of God’s Kingdom on earth was not about establishing ‘godly’ governments.  He stood before Pilate and said, “My Kingdom is not from here… [It has no such origin and source.  It is in the born again hearts and Scripturally renewed minds of true believers; My disciples who live in My Light or in Me Who Is The Light, because they follow Me and not deceivers,]” (Jn. 8:12.)  


The ranking order of ‘angelic apostles’

Wikipedia explained the hierarchical ranking-order of Irving’s Catholic Apostolic Church as, “Bishop, referred to as chief apostle or "angel,” priest, deacon…”  However, Mark, an ex-OAC member, explained the hierarchy of the Old Apostolic Church as follows, “Apostle and his wife.  Fourfold office and his wife (prophet, evangelist and overseer; overseer is deemed to consist of pastor and teacher in one office. Fourfold office is not an official title; it refers either to the prophet/evangelist/overseer.) Elder and his wife.  Priest and his wife.  Under-deacon and his wife.  Brother/sister/child…  The OAC priests believe their office is after the Order of Melchizedek.” 

¨ In opposition to this ‘apostolic’ and other priesthoods, the real Biblical priesthood of Melchizedek is a completely spiritual priesthood, (not just allegedly ‘spiritual in their minds,’ but spiritually born again in their human spirits through sincere faith in Jesus, (1 Ths. 5:23.)  1 Peter 2:9-10 proclaim, “[All sincerely and personally born again disciples] are [equal members of] a chosen generation, royal priesthood, and holy nation, His own special people, that they may proclaim the praises of Him Who called them out of darkness into His marvelous light,” (1 Col. 13:14; Eph. 1:7; 12-14.)  All these true believers, (not mere church attendees,) are Jesus’ priesthood after the Order of Melchizedek.  They serve without official titles and are the opposite of the ruling, ranking order of the Old Levitical priesthood of the Old Testament.  The Melchizedekian priesthood is Jesus’ entire body of Scripturally born again disciples, which contains every sincere believer on earth, not just some members of a particular church, (Jn. 3:16.) 

¨ In the context of New Testament Scripture, it is apparent that the words office’ and ‘bishop are Christian additives to Scripture to justify their unbiblical priesthoods.  As said in the beginning of this study, in God’s Word, the Bible, Jesus’ real ministers (or humble worker servants) are all equal and Only Jesus Christ Himself is the Eternal God, High Priest, “Head,” and Mediator according to the New Testament Order of Melchizedek


QUESTIONS and ANSWERS, APOSTOLIC MOVEMENT, [From: The Error of the Old Apostolic Church, F.W. Werner]  

Who are the Apostles of Christ?”  (Apostolics:  “They are the chosen elect, ambassadors, joyful messengers, angels of        God, known as the Apostles of Christ.”) 

Answer:  In Hebrew 1:7-14, as everywhere else in the Bible where God refers to angels, He definitely does not refer to human preachers such as ‘apostles.’  God knows the great difference between angels and humans; He created them.  Hebrews 2:6-9 declare that Christ Jesus, Who is God Himself, the Creator of the ‘worlds,’ (spiritual and material worlds, Heb. 1:1-14,) created humanity as a different species from the angels.  Because humanity was “created lower than the angels,” (as humans are flesh and blood and live here on earth,) the angelic agents of God minister supernaturally to humanity from the spirit world; guarding us, defending us, etcetera.  This cannot pertain to humans, that’s for sure. 


In what does the Mission of God exist?” (Apostolics: “Only in the Apostolic [church] Mission.”) 

Answer:  Jesus gave all His believing disciples only one commission, which totally refutes this ‘apostle mission.’  Matthew 28:18-20, [“I have given you My authority or anointing to] go make disciples, [not ‘apostles,’] of all the nations, water baptizing them in the Name of the Father, Son, and Holy Spirit, teaching them to observe all things that I [and not churches] have commanded you. [And you will see] that I am with you even to the end of the world.”  Evangelizing the whole world with the Gospel of the Lord Jesus Christ is a personal calling on the life of every true believer.  It begins in our own lives, homes, families, and expanding all around us as the Holy Spirit leads, (Acts 1:8.) 


From where do the Apostles come today?”  (Apostolics: “From the promise of Jesus Christ:  In the end of the world the Son of man will send forth His angels, and angels are the ministers of God, so are the apostles: Ministering Angels - Mt. 13:40-43; Gal. 4:14; Heb. 1:14.”) 

Answer:  The misquoted passage in Matthew 13:27-43 is also being abused to sustain the very entitled “apostle-angel” theory.  However, the “reapers” Jesus mentions here, do not refer to ‘apostles’ or other humans at all.  This parable explains the ‘good and bad seed that grow together.’  “Tares” is a weed that closely resembles corn, but it is actually poisonous.  It was maliciously sown among the “good seed.”  This represents the false Christians that resemble true believers.  When His disciples asked, “Do You want us to [go pluck them out?]” Jesus said, “No, [you might pluck up the wrong kind.]”  Literally, in the Final Day, God’s supernatural, heavenly spirits, the angels, and not human ministers of any kind, “will cast the bad seed [or all unrepentant twisters of His Truth and other sinners who feigned salvation] into the furnace of fire” or eternal hell; “where there will be wailing and the gnashing of teeth...”  God’s real hell in the spirit world cannot fit into the ‘apostle’ mind, that’s for certain. 

Paul warned in 2 Thessalonians 1:7-12, “...The Lord Jesus [will be] revealed from heaven [in the spirit world] with His mighty angels, [a once-off return,] with His mighty [supernatural] angels, in flaming fire taking vengeance on those who do not know God, and on those who do not obey the [real] Gospel of our Lord Jesus Christ, when He comes, in That [One] Day…”  How on earth can human beings fit themselves into “taking vengeance in flaming fire on unbelievers and those who do not obey the Gospel of Christ” — and excuse their own false dogmas and rejection of the God of the Bible and His True Word?   


How will Christ be seen today?” (Apostolics: “I am in you, Apostles, and you in Me,” (Jn. 14:20.)  “[Christ is seen] in ‘apostles’ word and work,” (Jn. 14:10-11.) 

Hymn 113, (Dutch Hymnbook, supplied by F.W. Werner,) “Jesus in d’ Apostl’len, Hem vertrouw ik dag en nag…Translated:  “The apostles who actually “became” Jesus, them I trust day and night…” 

Hymn 170: “’k Wil u volgen, myn Apostle!  Waar ook ‘t levenspad my leidt; Waar gy voorgaat, wil ek volgen…  Ja! Wy volgen u als Leidsman…  Buiten u voor ons geen leven; Blyf, Apostle! Ons naby.

Translated: “I want to follow you, my apostle! Wherever the road of life may lead. Where you lead, will I will follow…  Yes! I will follow you as shepherd…  Apart from you we have no life; Stay, apostle! Close to us.” 

¨ Again and again Scripture declared, only Jesus Christ, [through His entire contextual Word], is “The Apostle, Mediator, and High Priest,” Who must be followed! (Heb. 3:1; 1:1-14)  But blindly following blind guides, many denominations are now bringing believers back to that old ‘godfather’ tradition of Roman Catholicism; placing these so-called ‘restored’ prophets and apostles as ‘go-betweens’ between God and man. 

This ‘apostle’ worship is idolatry in its clearest form.  They substituted the omnipotent, omniscient, omnipresent Creator God of the universe with their so-called ‘apostle gods.’ 


The OAC member, who desperately tried to convert me, wrote, “Angels, according to many people, are in heaven ‘up there;’ they are not people.  According to the Bible, angels are clothed in white, and we must also clothe ourselves in white clothes.  This is God’s righteousness; God’s light, and so we will ‘become the light…’  [Not merely shine the Light, but ‘become’ the light or “Nur,” in Islamic terms.]  We become the body of Christ in the flesh, and so we become Christ…  Does this shock you?  Well, Paul wrote in Gal. 4:14 that “apostles” were received as angels of god — yes, as Jesus Christ!” 

¨ Answer:  Note again, the Lord Jesus Christ Is The Truth, The Way, The Life, and The Light, “and no one comes to the Father except through Him!” (Jn. 14:6.)  Hence, Paul and them were not received as actual angels; they were received with the respect shown to the Lord Jesus Christ and His supernatural angels.  Not because these men were god’s and christs as “apostles,” but because God commanded hospitality to the extent of even entertaining strangers as part of the Godly lifestyle in Christ.  Romans 12:10-11, “Be kindly affectionate to one another with brotherly love, in honor giving preference to one another… serving the Lord.” This is agape or “love in deed and truth,” and proof of emotional growth in Christ. Hebrews 13:2,16, “...For by so doing some have unwittingly entertained [real supernatural] angels [that took on the form of mere men to visit people like Abraham and Lot.]  Do not neglect doing good and sharing, for with such sacrifices God is pleased.” 


The Old Apostolic Church member continued, “Ephesians 4 explains the way in which our faith and the christ-gift were put together. The Christ-gift was given to everyone, who exists in the apostle, prophet, etcetera. [Isn’t it so that no one can “exist” except in the Creator God, the Lord Jesus Christ, Heb. 1:1-4?]  They equip the saints for their work and for building up the congregation.  In other words, the apostle is God’s apostle-gift, and together, all these gifts are the Christ-gift of God.  And so we [the OAC] all become spirits and angels of God, as we are the body of Christ! 

“John was also an angel of God, (Mt. 11:10,) as he was also a messenger of God, Who said, ‘I will send My messenger before Your face, who will prepare Your way before You.  [In truth, John the Baptist was beheaded for reprimanding the king, and real angels are ever-living. So, John could never have been a supernatural angel. What’s more, no one has to prepare the Way for Jesus ever again.  He fully established His New Testament Covenant at the cross and Pentecost for all eternity!]  Assuredly, I say to you, among those born of women, there has not risen any greater than John the Baptist…’  Paul, all the others, and we too, are messengers or ministers of God, and so became the greatest, Acts 15:35.  Jesus added, We became ministering spirits and angels.  Hebrews 1:13-14, “To which of the angels has He ever said: Sit at My right hand, till I make Your enemies Your footstool?  Are they not all ministering spirits (and this proves that angels are people,) sent forth to minister to those who will inherit salvation?’” 

¨ Answer:  “Jesus added that they became ministering spirits and angels?”  This is literally putting lies in Jesus’ mouth by adding such wild assumptions to His Word.  So, let us again bring the truth of context to this incredible blasphemy, which continually attempts to make Christ Jesus abdicate His throne and contradict His Word!  There is only One God and His Name is the Lord Jesus Christ of the Bible, and He shares His throne with no one.  And as said, if humans could “become spirits or supernatural angels,” it would be an interspecies abomination like in Gen. 6. 

¨ To get the truth of the allegation that “’apostles’ have become the greatest,” let us simply complete the verse in Matthew 11:11, where Jesus said, “...But he who is least in the kingdom of heaven is greater than John the Baptist!”  Jesus warned in Luke 22:25, “The [godless] exercise lordship over one another… but not so among you… He who is the greatest among you… [must] be everyone’s servant…”  ‘Apostle gods’ are not mentioned here!  Although the human spirits of sincerely, Scripturally born again disciples ‘became’ the temple of the Most High God when the Holy Spirit indwelt them at their rebirth, they remain the children, servants, and disciples of Jesus Christ, (1 Cor. 6:15-20.) 

¨ In addition, even Scriptural and sincere human ministers cannot compare to Jesus or His Holy Spirit in any way; they are not God, or His ‘gifts’ to mankind.  They are not “the greatest” but in humble servanthood they must be “the least.” All true believers have received spiritual gifts from the Holy Spirit to equip them for ministry as His human instruments on the earth, (1 Cor. 12:4-11.)  However, Biblical ‘elders’ or, in fact, the Scriptural, non-ranking spiritual elderly,’ were and are ordinary human beings who, “in all lowliness bear with one another in love…” (Eph. 4:2.) The Scriptural ‘elderly’ are humble, human servants of the human members of the body of Christ, as Jesus Himself had demonstrated and commanded in John 13:1-17! 

In the truth of New Testament Scripture, the ‘lofty office’ of ‘chief apostle, bishop, or chief pastor/priest/minister over the congregation and other pastors and ministers, simply does not exist!  Jesus’ real ‘elderly’ or servants cannot occupy ranking positions among His body of believers.  The entire body is equal and on the same spiritual level — only the Head and High Priest of the body, Jesus Himself, is God and Savior of the entire body,  (Eph. 5:22-24.)